To Flash or to Java that is the question!

[gilaniali]

hi

i would like to build a chess game (read on, not like the chess games discussed already). heres how this works, this will be played on a browser(no downloading or anything) over the internet, with two players. the player can movie the pieces with either the mouse or the keyboard. Also they can rotate the chess board or their own camera angle to see the different positions of the board. this is not like the usual games where u get a bird-eyes view, but rather a 3D envirnoment with 3d pieces and a board like chessmaster. Also as it is over the internet, the game must load quickly.

So now what should i use?? java or flash?? and with the 3d thing, should i also use 3d studio max or some program like that or can java or flash can take care of it??

TO get a fair viewpoint i am also posting this message on the java site javaranch.com, its in the forums in the games section. check it out
Ali.

[pellepiano]

the game must load quickly.

This will be hard as you need multiple shots of each piece, if you are going to be able to rotate it. If you have four angles, there will be a minimum of 48 images of the different chess pieces. ( although you can load the angled shots of the pieces only when needed, to save some initial loading time.

You probably will need to save the images as png files as you need to use transparency to have just the chess piece to show.

For 3d 3d studio is a good choice ( there are many other capable programs that can make chess pieces too, like cinema4, maya,soft image, lightwave, strata 3d, carrara and so on ).

You will also need a server that can connect the two players.

[nGFX]

just my personal quick point of view ...

you won't have much luck with realtime-3d on either platform (although there is an opengl lib for java, i believe)
also the performance of java should be better than the flash performance (but then, a gif has better performance )

otherwise you will have to use pre-rendered images of the pieces (as said above) on both platforms ...

my personal advice is to use flash ... why?
a) for now flash is quite save (haven't found a flash virus till now, but my av-guard has filtered about 5 java virii (and i don't visit java sites very often) - so i have removed every bit of java from my comp ...)
b) flash should be on nearly every web capable browser (and if not, well 400k for the plugin is not much, as i recal it right the java install is over 10mb)
c) flash is easy ...

but hey, it just me ... regards nGFX

[webgeek]

Please forgive me for being quite blunt, but this line is just complete BS:

"for now flash is quite save (haven't found a flash virus till now, but my av-guard has filtered about 5 java virii (and i don't visit java sites very often) - so i have removed every bit of java from my comp ...)"

There are known security holes in the Flash player (go search on Macromedia's site for them) but to my knowledge not ONE fully credited Java security hole has been located. I'm not saying there arn't some but I'm sure it would be well publicised. You listed the reasons in your post for Java to NOT be effective as a virus. It requires some configuration on a given machine AND needs the Java runtime. How is that going to work? The virus would need to be 10 megs. I think it's time you got a new virus scanner.

[murraymint]

Have you considered Director gilaniali?

It has built in 3D functions which are more than capable of producing the kind of game you are talking about.

The game code shouldn't be too complex with just pieces moving along a horizontal plane and the odd camera rotation/pan.

[gilaniali]

ok so heres what i get so far. java will be slower, so flash is a good option.

For flash will i need to make the 3d board and piece in another animation software such as maya or 3d? or can flash take care of it. Is there an example of a game where a person has used Flash for 3d effects in a game. Ppl play CHessmaster and u'll get an idea of what i am trying to achieve.

Ali

[nGFX]

Originally posted by webgeek
Please forgive me for being quite blunt, but this line is just complete BS:

"for now flash is quite save (haven't found a flash virus till now, but my av-guard has filtered about 5 java virii (and i don't visit java sites very often) - so i have removed every bit of java from my comp ...)"

There are known security holes in the Flash player (go search on Macromedia's site for them) but to my knowledge not ONE fully credited Java security hole has been located. I'm not saying there arn't some but I'm sure it would be well publicised. You listed the reasons in your post for Java to NOT be effective as a virus. It requires some configuration on a given machine AND needs the Java runtime. How is that going to work? The virus would need to be 10 megs. I think it's time you got a new virus scanner.

okok, i forgive you ...

SYMPTOM(S)

Malicious applets have been discovered in the JRE cache directory. Anti-virus programs have detected such malicious applets in the following directory:

C:\Documents and Settings\<username>\Application Data\Sun\Java\Deployment\cache\javapi\v1. 0\jar\

taken from : http://java.com/en/download/help/cache_virus.jsp

as i'm not into java anymore (and i really don't care if the thing is malicious or not) the fact is, that my antivir has gone wild ... displaying that there is a virus beeing downloaded.

but who am i to judge, i still use windows ... however me and a lot of people i work for/with don't have java installed.

<olli/>

[webgeek]

okok, i forgive you ...

Thanks

From that same URL, just about the next line down, it says this:
--
If you are using the Sun JVM™ as your default virtual machine, these malicious applets cannot cause any harm to your computer.
--
That about sums it up. The correct implementation of Java doesn't have the vulnerabilities.

however me and a lot of people i work for/with don't have java installed.

You are completely correct here. The runtime is not that common out there. Something like 20% tops!

Have fun!